Re: Difficulty with large posting board.

"Gary Charpentier" <gldncagrls@aol.com.mil> wrote in message 
news:ga1v2a$jmf$1@aioe.org...
> Apples and Oranges wrote:
>> "Gary Charpentier" <gldncagrls@aol.com.mil> wrote in message
>> news:ga1jnc$a03$1@aioe.org...
>>> Apples and Oranges wrote:
>>>> "Gary Charpentier" <gldncagrls@aol.com.mil> wrote in message
>>>> news:ga0vf7$d7s$1@aioe.org...
>>>>> Apples and Oranges wrote:
>>>>>> I have great difficulty posting ads on craigslist.org.  At first 
>>>>>> there
>>>>>> are
>>>>>> flagging bullies that are right there to delete my ads.  And I mean
>>>>>> within
>>>>>> minutes, at any hour (3am), all week long.  I post again and tell 
>>>>>> them
>>>>>> that
>>>>>> if they just let the ads drop in the list, they would get less
>>>>>> exposure
>>>>>> anyway.  I have no desire to post and post, I just want one little ad
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> show up on an occasional basis or so and drop in the list like
>>>>>> everyone
>>>>>> else.  When my ads do get through, I get lots of positive
>>>>>> responses.  I
>>>>>> get
>>>>>> angry emails by supposed craigslist users whom I suspect are
>>>>>> associated
>>>>>> with
>>>>>> craigslist because after these "posting wars," my ads just vanish (no
>>>>>> notification).  I get an email saying that it was posted but when I
>>>>>> watch
>>>>>> for it, it never shows up.  I believe craigslist programmers have
>>>>>> added
>>>>>> filters into their software to destroy posts.  My evidence is that
>>>>>> when I
>>>>>> post other ads for other mundane purposes, no problem.  When I use
>>>>>> another
>>>>>> machine and another rarely used account, no problem.  But my usual
>>>>>> accounts
>>>>>> and usual IP's cannot get an ad through on craigslist.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Do other people have problems with this board?  I have received hate
>>>>>> mail
>>>>>> saying that craigslist has a right to do whatever they want.  OK - I
>>>>>> agree,
>>>>>> it's their website.  But if they are masquerading as fair service but
>>>>>> are
>>>>>> really picking and choosing???  I think some people would like to 
>>>>>> know
>>>>>> about
>>>>>> it.  I have begun to keep screenshots and all my emails to prove this
>>>>>> is
>>>>>> happening.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Should I try to get a PI or some kind of lawyer to investigate
>>>>>> this?  I
>>>>>> am
>>>>>> just asking because like I said, I do get good results when my
>>>>>> posts do
>>>>>> get
>>>>>> through for a short time on a rare occasion.
>>>>>
>>>>> Mundane = legal
>>>>> not mundane = illegal?
>>>>>
>>>>> Is that the crux of your problem?
>>>>> T
>>>>
>>>> Are you someone who places such emphasis on the TOS that you bypass all
>>>> other forms law, practices of courtesy, and common sense?  There are
>>>> many who hold others to the TOS at such a level that only a very few
>>>> people, usually the competition, can meet those terms.  There is a
>>>> concept in real law that says the law is a living and bending process
>>>> open for interpretation.  Anyway, the posts are similar to other posts
>>>> on the board and are as legal or more legal than the other posts which
>>>> are not picked on.
>>>
>>> Just because person A's crime isn't prosecuted doesn't mean person B can
>>> commit
>>> the crime and not be punished.  You know that not everyone who runs a 
>>> red
>>> light
>>> gets a ticket.
>>
>> Not talking about crime here I don't think, but I guess that's part of my
>> question.
>>
>>>
>>> As you are asking in a legal forum, the TOS is a contract.  As long as 
>>> it
>>> does
>>> not violate some other law it is enforceable.  And enforceable means 
>>> that
>>> at
>>> some point the government will chase you down to put you in a cage if 
>>> you
>>> refuse
>>> to obey the orders of the court.
>>
>> Fine, but if they let some people violate while not others.  Not a valid
>> contract.
>
> You are making a rash assumption that the posts are being reported.  You 
> are
> also assuming the others aren't using some weasel wording that lets them 
> pass on
> the TOS.
>

I am trying to determine who is deleting my posts.  As stated, I seem to be 
bullied by some outside group, but then after diligence in posting, it is as 
if they give up and my posts just get deleted without any notification as if 
someone inside at craigslist just deletes them.  If not, all appologies to 
craigslist.  But seems fishy that some of my posts with certain wording (ie 
a link to my website) just never go through (they used to).  They never show 
up but I get an email saying all is well.

> If they are being reported and arn't using a weasel wording then you might 
> be
> right, just witness Verizon, Comcast, Road Runner, AT&T, et. al. and the 
> NY AG
> and his CP reign of usenet terror.
>

Curious, I would like to more about this.

>>>
>>> You mention common sense.  That does not apply to questions of law.
>>
>> Usually it does, but you are correct, sometimes it doesn't.  What would 
>> you
>> do if you were in the middle of a desert and came across a red light. 
>> You
>> wait 2 min, 5, 15 30 min.  You can see the horizon, no cars for miles.
>> Maybe the red light is stuck?  You die of starvation waiting for this red
>> light because it is illegal to run red lights.  Yes, I know a silly
>> example,
>> but maybe that is why there are lawyers...because real life is 
>> complicated
>> enough that all the language that a lawyer uses can't encompass 
>> everything
>> possibly leaving some decisions for the rest of us who are not lawyers to
>> use common sense and hopefully not get thrown in jail for it.
>
> You get to use common sense on the police officer before he gets out his 
> ticket
> pad because you aren't in court yet.  You can argue to the judge and jury 
> that
> you didn't intend to break the law, mens rea, because you honestly thought 
> the
> signal had malfunctioned.  If the judge lets you get away with it you can 
> even
> go for jury nullification.
>
>>>
>>> You say more legal.  Again, doesn't apply.  They are either legal or
>>> illegal.
>>> No in between.
>>>
>>
>> But we are talking about enforced for some, but not others.
>
> Again, does every drunk driver land in jail?  No.  Not even when a cop 
> sees him.
> The cop isn't required to make an arrest.  He may have other things that 
> are
> more important, even the donut run.
>
>>>
>>>> mundane = legal and somewhat useless, not clever in anyway, would not
>>>> sell on the open market, does not offend anyone, etc.
>>>>
>>>> not mundane = new ideas, might challenge the status quo, would probably
>>>> offend the established competition, might be worth something.
>>>
>>> Ah, offending the competition.  Sure the competition can report you all
>>> they
>>> want as long as they are truthful in reporting it.  So can a do good nut
>>> case.
>>> You have to live with it and stay legal.
>>>
>>> You will have to make your claims for whatever it is we are discussing 
>>> so
>>> they
>>> do not violate the TOS or not sell things that the TOS says you
>>> can't.  Or
>>> you
>>> can find somewhere else to sell.
>>>
>>> Yes it is that simple.
>>
>> Here is how simple it is...
>>
>>  There are 3 kinds of people in the world...
>>
>>  Group 1.  People who think criagslist can do no wrong and is great.
>>  Group 2.  People who do not think this.
>>  Group 3.  People who do not care.
>>
>> I assume you are in group 1.
>
> You assume wrong.  Morally I think they have a lot to answer for, but 
> legally I
> don't know of anything.
>
>> I am in group 2 wishing to talk to other
>> people in group 2.
>
> Then perhaps alt.craigslist.die.die.die might be a better place.
>
>> Not group 1.  I wish I were in group 3.  I would
>> post my
>> ad and forget about it and then go about my day shopping and being
>> happy.  I
>> then might come home to some messages from customers who might wish to 
>> use
>> my services so I can make a living and afford to go shopping some more.
>>
>>>
>>> But you knew that already, you wanted to know if there was some way to
>>> weasel
>>> out of it.  Sorry all holes closed.
>>>
>>
>> Weasel!  That is a word I was looking for.  I am asking if craigslist is 
>> a
>> weasel.  I already know that it is legal to be a weasel.
>>
>>> But in all cases of law, your case is specific.  Print out the TOS and
>>> your ad,
>>> look up a lawyer in the phone book, pay his fee and see what he has to
>>> say
>>> about
>>> your specific case.  He might tell you to change a comma to a period and
>>> everything will be different.  You do know they argue about the
>>> comma's in
>>> the
>>> Second Amendment to the US Constitution don't you?
>>>
>>
>> Yes, I do know this.  And the First Amendment says I can bitch as
>> long as I don't yell fire in a crowded theater.  But the Constitution is 
>> a
>> long way from some website's TOS.  I am not really looking for a lawsuit
>> here.
>
> There are a lot more things that yelling fire that will get you locked up. 
> I
> might know about that being as I'm one of the doe plaintiff's in Free 
> Speech
> Coalition v. Gonzales (2005)

Interesting...

>
>> All I want to do is post my ad.  At this point, I am just asking 
>> questions:
>> Who am I?  Why am I here?  Do other people have difficulty with this
>> website?
>
> Might ask on a group dedicated to users of Craigslist then, rather than a 
> legal
> group.
>

I had this group in my list and it was close enough.  There is always a 
better group, I suppose.  Or I could start my own group called 
craigslist.specific.problem.this.and.that.  But here I may have a chance 
(teeny tiny) at getting the attention of someone with some clout (mean pricy 
lawyer or something who likes me).

I did not wish to get into a TOS argument.  I have had them before and they 
are frustrating unless one enjoys circular arguments that never go anywhere. 
My posts aren't perfect, I'll admit.  Fact is, craigslist has a TOS clause 
that compartmentalizes everyone to their location.  My biggest violation is 
that I post in a larger city than the village that I live in in hopes of 
reaching a large enough market.  And there are MANY who violate this.  I 
would expect to get caught some of the time.  I would expect my posts to get 
ignored much of the time.  Now, however, 100% of my posts cannot get 
through.  I am seeking an explanation.  Have I been banned?  What can I do 
about it?  (And I know...not much).  Has anyone else ever been banned and 
not told?